Three-way tie for mayor, bag fee rejected

Geeky Swedes Ballard

As expected, the race for mayor is tight as ever, with Mayor Greg Nickels, Mike McGinn and Joe Mallahan neck-and-neck in primary results. Meanwhile, the 20-cent bag fee initiative has been rejected by a wide margin, and Susan Hutchison and Dow Constantine will battle it out in November for King County Executive. You can get the latest wrap-up on the Seattle Times.

Since the election was held entirely by mail, the final results could take several days, especially for close races. Just before polls closed at 8 p.m., one Ballard voter said there was a last-minute rush at the Ballard library. “About 2 people per second are dropping off their ballots,” he tweeted. This is a photo taken earlier today when a rush of early-morning ballots jammed the drop-off box, forcing some people to walk away without casting their vote.

Geeky Swedes

The founders of My Ballard

127 thoughts to “Three-way tie for mayor, bag fee rejected”

  1. Crap. I'm really sad about the bag thing.
    Sorry to all the variety of supporters out there, I know even saying that I supported the bag fee thing will give me grief.
    But I was hoping for a change.
    Ah well.. I know I'm doing my part albeit the little part that it is.
    And now my neighbors will continue to throw their plastic bags all willy nilly in to the recycle bin.
    It frustrates me to no end.
    Oh well. Congrats to you all. You win.

  4. The mayor and city council got a beat down from the voters over this bag thing. It shows you how out of touch they are.
    The silent majority has spoken!

  5. True, recycling is better than the landfill. But remember, reduce and reuse come before recycle. The energy to keep recycling a bag over and over is more than the energy to make a reusable bag once. When the plastics industry spokesman said they supported recycling, that's because they get to keep making the same bag over and over.

  6. why people assume it's their right to get a free bag when you buy groceries is beyond me.

    as usual, deep pockets won. thanks for further polluting our world, you jerks.

  7. But they arent “recycling” them. They just throw them all in there individually. Or fill them with other things (sometimes not recycling things either). The recycling habits of my neighbors continues to be a thorn in my side every time I bring my clean recycling out there.

  9. Here's hoping the beat down isn't over yet. This King County Council had better pay close attention to this vote, clean up their thieving nanny state mind set, or pack their bags.
    Yeah, and now there's 39 parks slated to be closed, parks fully funded by a vote of the people two years ago. They had better be held accountable this time.

  10. The stupidest thing in the whole anti-campaign were the commercials that said “We're being taxed for something we already do”. Well if you already do it, you won't be taxed. Kind of like the idiots who complain about getting tickets for running red lights.

    As for the free bags, they're not actually “free”. I use a cloth bag and get 3-5 cents back every time I use it, so I like the fact that my grocery bills are not higher due to all the “free” bags the stores are giving out.

  11. I've brought my own bags to the supermarket for the past six months, and I voted against the bag tax because it was ridiculous.
    For centuries merchants have provided their customers with a tool to carry their purchases home. Whether satchels, boxes, or plastic bags, providing a method to carry purchases is a merchant-provided courtesy.
    To date, every merchant continues this courtesy, and singling out grocery stores for a bag tax is hypocritical at best.
    Additionally, people should be rewarded for good deeds – not punished. Safeway gives shoppers $.03 for every re-usable bag they use while shopping, and QFC donates $.03 for every re-usable bag to charity.
    Taxes don't change people's behavior, and I encourage everyone to continue, or to start using re-usable bags while shopping just because it feels so darned good! ;-)

  12. You realize that the entire motivation for the bag initiaitive by the council was to generate money. This was simply an incredibly non-progressive tax that would have made poor people's grocery bills go up by a substantial percentage.

  13. If voters were made aware of how much money it cost to pull the plastic out of a jammed the sorting machine, I suspect people would be p8ssed at those who gave away bagss for free.

    Alas, ths city did not put out those figures.

  14. I understand you frustration… but the reason my husband and I did not vote FOR it is because we really did not believe the city knows how to make it successful, or how to manage it! Seriously, who is going to “police” it to make sure the stores are really reporting how much they are taking in on the bag fee? For what will the money collected *really* end up being used? Plus, most people who don't already bring bags with them to the grocery store, probably wouldn't balk much at an extra dollar for 5 bags at the grocery store. Not to mention the exclusions (like hard goods vs. groceries) still meant lots of plastic bags being used! It just wasn't the right plan for now.

    If you really want to help, start with your neighbors in your apartment building. Talk to the landlord about making more of an effort to get folks to sort and dispose of things the right way. Landlords can be FINED if tenants are not using the recycling units properly.

    Whose to say if this had passed your neighbors would stop the “willy nilly”ness?!?

  15. People won't vote for something that will cost them money on a shopping trip that is already costing them money. We need to have a vote to ban plastic bags and see where that takes us.

  16. I think it was a combination of the bag tax and the (lack of) response during the snowstorm last year. That pretty much killed Nickels's career.

  17. Or be more proactive about offering a discount if you bring your own bags, whether they're cloth or not. I'd be much more inclined to take reusable bags if there is an across-the-board discount for doing so.

    I also don't think the city council really took into account the people who can't afford to pay 20 cents per bag and/or can't afford to pay $1/bag for a reusable one.

    I also don't appreciate being guilted into recycling or being green in this situation. It should be my choice, not a government mandate.

  18. What a load of crap! So poor people can't afford a reusable bag ($0.99)? So they would throw away 20 cents over and over again and never catch on to reusing bags? It seems to me a very weak argument.

  19. And you're all talking about this like it was JUST the plastic bags … it's also the paper bags, leaving no more “store courtesy” alternative. It was just a bad, bad idea. I'm all for reducing and reusing (and I do), but I want my government to trust me as a responsible citizen to make that choice when and how it works for me. I'm responsible in my purchases, and I'm responsible with my recycling (and trash). I don't need Mayor Nickels-and-Dimes intruding into my kitchen to make sure I'm doing things the “right” way. Grrrrr.

  20. Bad idea, no it was great policy undone by bad politics. As a matter of policy it works great is areas that adopted the same law. It was bad politics to put such a complicated measure on a ballot. The education and deliberation required to make this happen.. well it never should have left the city council and been handed over to the public.

  21. You are mistaken. There were provisions in the masure to address the needs of low income people to get them bags.

    Also, the fee was designed to discourage the use of bags – (when people have to pay, the generally use less). Lastly, the city was trying to create a way for to pay for the costs these bags pass on to the city in the form municipal waste issues.

  22. “QFC donates $.03 for every re-usable bag to charity. “

    QFC donates to charity already, they just do this to let you think you're doing something for charity and that they're doing something for you. I'm fairly sure their charitable contributions haven't increased because of this.

  23. The pro-bag-fee argument was outspent, pure and simple. 15-to-1. The “American Chemistry Council”, a Virginia-based plastic industry group, threw in most of the $1.4 MILLION that was spent to kill the fee by blasting out their message.

    As a Seattle voter, I'm indignant and disturbed that an out-of-state corporate entity can throw money around in our elections like that, and get what they want with it. It's quite a lot like what happened with Prop 8 in California, though of course the bag fee isn't nearly as big a deal. In both cases, though, democracy got trampled by outside money.

    Whether or not you think the bag fee was a good idea, there's nothing good about having our elections manipulated.

  25. Okay, off of the bag thing and on to the mayoral race. I will be quite sad to see Nickels get edged off of the ballot. I am all for the tunnel and would hate to see McGinn win. The surface street would be O.K., but it would be a shame to squander our one chance to get this right and to put the by-pass underground.

  26. Is that a done deal, yet? Nickels is only 450 votes behind Mallahan, and there are plenty of ballots left to count. I'd be surprised if a lead of 450 votes was insurmountable at this point.

  27. Man you really fell for it.

    1) I'm sure a lot of low-income people are going to go downtown, fill out a form, wait for the bag-czar to approve their application and give them three reusable bags.
    2) If a plastic bag cost the city $0.20 to put in a landfill, then my garbage fee should be something like $100,000 a month.

    The simple truth is that while doing things to protect the environment are good, don't let politicians take advantage of that desire to generate revenue in the name of “protecting the environment”

    Don't be a sucker.

  28. For at least the last 20 years in Germany you've had to pay for the bags you use. Here we all pay for the bags whether we use them or not. Every purchase made at the store contains a few cents of markup to cover the cost of bags. The number of bags is huge which is why the palstics companies were willing to spend 1.3 MILLION DOLLARS to fight it. Think about that…they're willing to invest $1,300,000 to keep their revenue stream up. I'm sure they looked at what they make in plastic bag profit from Seattle and figured that they could afford $1,300,000 to keep those profits rolling in.
    Trust me, whether you pay twenty cents or get three cents credited, you're still paying for bags.

  29. Part of the 20 cent fee was destined to go back to subsidizing reusable bags for the poor.
    This initiative was poorly organized and presented, and in my opinion never should have been on the ballot, but just legislated and done.

  31. The initiative would have set up a whole office downtown to manage the bag situation. Sounds like productive good use of our money!

  32. That I would agree with. Eventually I hope that we have such leaders. Currently, we just don't.
    Spineless, effect less, and beholding to all the wrong people.

  37. But if nobody used the plastic bags, which I assume is the point of the tax, where would the subsidies come from?

    It doesn't change the fact, however, that the Seattle city council seems to think that the citizens are idiots and incapable of recycling of their own accord. Personally, I use plastic bags for more than just carrying groceries. Until a good biodegradable plastic bag for used kitty litter comes along, I'm going to use plastic bags I get “for free” from the store. :)

    I disagree that it should have just been legislated and done. Not in this economy. Anything having to do with money coming directly out of the pockets of the citizens should definitely be voted on by said citizens.

  38. I love how people keep referring to this. I can't recall seeing a 'vote no' ad. Can anyone point one out? It seems to me they got the most publicity from the media reporting they donated money to the 'vote no' campaign.

  40. You're probably (I won't assume) an example of someone who would have voted against it anyway, whether the plastic companies got involved or not. And there are plenty of you, sure.

    I'm not saying that the fee would necessarily have passed if the plastic companies hadn't spent $1.4 million. Maybe it would have, maybe it wouldn't. We'll never know.

    Because the fact is, they /did/ spend that money on that scale, and they /did/ win votes with it. Money always changes minds. It doesn't make sense to deny that. And this was money on a scale that's way out of whack with the size of the issue.

  41. Once you put a tax on something it is that much harder to get rid of because the government looks at it as a source of revenue and jobs. Think about it, if the bag tax passed then you would have a new gov't bag tax department or extra work and job security for other government departments. This legislating was more self serving than caring about the environment.

    If you think plastic bags are more harm than good then just ban them.

  42. Wonderful spin Curmudgeon – How you get from “creating two new positions” to “Czar” is beyond me.

    I guess “Whole Office Downtown” does not inspire enough fear.

    Still czar is too comical next time try Fascist, Terrorist, Nazi, Hitler, and Hussein those seem to work much better.

  43. Seattle politicians have zero balls. I'm appalled at how much crap ends up on the ballot in a confusing manner just to shirk accountability of their elected office.

  46. I'm feeling a bit sheepish, myself. I voted for not-Nickels, because I assumed that Nickels would be on the ballot regardless and I wanted to see a strong challenger. I think the best contest in the general election would be between Nickels and somebody else.

  47. ” I'm all for reducing and reusing (and I do), but I want my government to trust me as a responsible citizen to make that choice when and how it works for me. I'm responsible in my purchases, and I'm responsible with my recycling (and trash). “

    Ditto. And I'm all for leading by example and educating folks to understand WHY reusing and recycling is the way to go.

    I'd rather have out of towners visit and say, ” Wow, you Seattle guys willing bring a reusable bag to the grocers. Maybe I should do that too” than go home saying “Seattle charges its people who don't bring their own bag.”

  48. I applaude your attempt to lump me in with the nut jobs. But just to let you know, calling the head of a department a Czar isn't the same thing as yelling nazi. Feel free to bring it up with the Drug Czar (the term we've been using for the head of the director of drug abuse policy since the 70's).

    Don't confuse someone who is skeptical about the motives of local government and taxes with black helicopter paranoids.

  49. No question money makes a difference, no question it is the biggest reason that elections go the way they do. I'm happy in this case, it was money well spent, if it had any effect.
    It didn't affect my stance, but folks are easily swayed by a lot of stuff, generally.
    Don't worry, we'll have leaders with a spine someday, they'll ban the damn things, which if they were smart, not greedy, woulda coulda shoulda happened.

  50. I'm fearful that a lot of folks made that assumption. Quite fearful in fact! I am having flashbacks to theNader voters in 2000 that scuttled it all for Gore. At least our Mayor, whomever it turns out to be, can't lead us into war and financial ruin….right? right?

  57. I agree with just banning the stupid bags. I have switched to mainly using the re-usable bags and I love them. They are far more durable and easier to manage than flimsy plastic bags.

    As for money, sure it makes a difference. I know the plastic bags we get today are not 'free'. Of course some small mark-up is added to grocery store items to compensate. But if you ask a lot of people the following question “do you want to start paying more for your groceries or not?” you're not going to get a >50% yes vote out of it. Why would anyone willingly sign up to pay more for the exact same thing they are getting today? And don't think the grocery stores would lower their prices because they no longer have to hand out 'free' bags.

    Again, if the environment is the concern, and it should be, just ban the plastic bags!

  61. I'm under no illusion that any Mayor can lead us into war. It was meant to be a reference to the buffoon that was our previous President…

  62. Just Ban – I'm ok with that, but there seems to be too much “democracy” in this town, no one ever wants to just do it! There is always a chance to kick the can to someone else, and duck the heat.

  63. I believe that the bag fee would have failed regardless of out of state money involved. Seattlites are growing tired of 'greenies.' Another trend is all.

  69. re: the bag fee the LAST thing this city needs is a department for plastic bag police. Enivronmental concerns were always a red herring … if the city truly cared one whit about environmental concerns they'd just ban both paper and plastic bags outright, not stoop to a silly cash grab. Thankfully most voters saw right through this ploy.

    Most bag fee supporters I spoke with also never realized that stores like Costco and Wal-Mart were exempt from this, stores making over $1 million could keep the bag tax revenue … this was a terrible idea to begin with made worse by trying to cloak it in a green guise. The only green thing about the bag tax was the money the City stood to make off it.

    Either ban the bags outright or leave the environment out of it altogether.

  70. “This initiative was poorly organized and presented, and in my opinion never should have been on the ballot, but just legislated and done.”

    They tried that in City Council and enough people made a stink about it that it was put on the ballot. Apparently from the results it definitely wasn't a popular measure even with the out of town money … and had it been simply “legislated and done” as you put it likely would have resulted in a lawsuit overturning it anyways, and resulting in more expense to City taxpayers.

    Ultimately, it was a bad idea, an unpopular idea and it went down in flames. The process worked here even if some folks aren't happy with the result.

  71. I still don't get how people could be unhappy with this result. If you're so anxious to throw money away just write a check to the city.

  73. Why ban them? I just don't get the logic behind the arguement. I use reusable bags because I think it is the right thing to do however I don't get the logic behind the anti-bag position.

  75. I can't believe that so much copy here is being used up on the bag fee.. something that should be legislated and done with anyway (thus negating the influence of expensive ads from the Chemistry Council.

    I think the big story here is Nichols, and the effect that his elimination will have on the eventual viaduct compromise. Does this mean that the bored tunnel is gone? Do people realize that mallahan and mcginn (nutjob) are anti tunnel, and pro streets option?

    I for one am disappointed that this may mean going back to that issue yet AGAIN. I was happy with Nichol's work there and the compromise.

  78. Most bag fee supporters you spoke with never realized that Costco and Wal-Mart were exempt from the fee because that's not true. It's FUD from the plastic industry. Don't take my word for it — read the referendum again, or check this out:
    http://crosscut.com/2009/08/04/2009-election/19…

    Bag fees have worked elsewhere, like Ireland. Ref 1 was a reasonable attempt to cut plastic use, and the proceeds would all have gone to garbage reduction and recycling expenditures. It made sense.

    Banning disposable bags would also make sense. Hopefully the city will give that a go, now.

  79. The article you post is an excellent example of why I say that Seattle is growing tired of ‘greenies.’ I truly believe that half of those who voted against the fee did so because they are so turned off by the green crap coming from our mayor and his minions. I know maybe 5 people in this city who actually live a greener life than I do and they are not the vocal types we see on this blog or in the news. Like me they just go about their business without getting their panties in a wad. I guarantee that I leave a smaller footprint than most of those who rant about environmental issues.

  82. Chopper_74: You should become better informed before you make such sweeping comments. Nothing? Yeesh.

    I just checked out your comment history and you have 123 pages worth. I can see why you don't have time for any research on the topics you comment on. You really like this echo-chamber, don't you? I bet you feel like you are a community activist because you read this blog. No need to respond….I'm signing off now…

  84. ah, but respond I will.
    Do I know the latest of what folks think?
    No.
    Do I care what most folks think?
    No.
    Do I share what I think?
    Yes.
    Does what I think change? Ever?
    All the time.
    But that doesn't make me special,
    it just makes me like everyone else.
    Sorry that you had to sign off.
    I'll stand by nothing, unless you think that quasi (aka, wimpy as hell) limiting Marijuana busts, and allowing goats within the city is something…
    Go ahead, pick on me.

  86. I suspect they also spent a lot of that money for people to appear on TV/radio and write op eds and even write comments on blogs and news sites.

  89. Seriously. Have you done much traveling around the rest of the country? Recycling and reduction are just not prevalent in many areas I've visited. Reducing waste and recycling are great, but we're already voluntarily doing waaaay more than much of the rest of the country. If this is something so dear the mayor's heart, maybe he should lead the charge to educate other mayors and push for them to improve recycling efforts in their cities.

  90. recycling or not, the plastics eventually wind up all over the place and a lot of it winds up as particles in the ocean that the fish eat with the effect of starving them on a full stomach.

  91. C'mon chopper, we both know that if the council just legislated that all stores had to charge a nickel for each bag a customer used that you and all the other libertarian cranks would be marching downtown about the outrage of government telling business what to do. You can't have it both ways.

  92. Ha! We're in a tight race right now and not all of the votes counted. Give it time. If it's really close, we're looking at recounts and all that fun stuff a la Gregoire and Rossi. I doubt Nickels will stop fighting if he thinks he's got a snowball's chance …. oh wait, let me rephrase that …..

  93. It's a product of the media and the cranks. Every time a politician steps up with anything that can be deemed at all controversial, let alone something that needs more than a bumper sticker to explain, they get shouted down and shown the door. Our politicians quickly realize that there is so much loud opposition to everything that they just kick it to the voters to avoid being bashed by the cranks.

  95. A few years ago I was visiting a friend's place in Redmond and went to throw something in the recycling bin only to find that the big green bin was the trash and the little green bin was the recycling. The exact opposite of Seattle.
    The majority of people just don't give a —- about anything outside of who's getting voted off of whatever TV show. Without government mandates (that are hard enough to get through the lobbies and narrow interests) we'd still be driving around without airbags or seatbelts and filling up with leaded gas. Nobody complains about that now, but they all made a huge ruckus when it was first proposed.

  96. I always thought chopper was one of those ‘stop asking government to do everything for you’ types. Yet he whines over elected officials doing nothing.

  97. Well the people who collected signatures to get it on the ballot were paid about 3 x more per signature than what is usually paid. I think you missed your chance to cash in.

    Honestly, getting a bill written for a city legislature, before the public made it very easy to kill. The pro message was too complicated to resonate.

    Pro or con, the campaign to defeat this measure was a professional hit from out of town. Its funny that a place that likes to keep it fresh local and organic, was duped by rotten, imported and plastic.

  101. Yes, that would be a tax. No, I wouldn't agree.
    Suppose they said, “You cannot use plastic bags in the course of business anywhere in the city.”
    Good, because I don't.
    Like they said, 'You cannot use poly-styrene clam shell to go containers anywhere in the city.”
    Good, because I don't.
    Like they said, “You cannot use 'trans-fats', sell anything that contains 'trans-fats' or have any 'trans-fats' on your premises”
    Good, because I don't.
    Maybe, you get the picture.
    Some of us are well ahead of the curve, and despise paying taxes for those who aren't.
    You can quote me.

  105. Only McGinn is anti-tunnel and pro-surface stupidity. Mallahan says it's time to end the debate over the viaduct and build the tunnel.

    If Seattle government abandons the tunnel in favor of… nothing… we are fried.

  108. “Have you done much traveling around the rest of the country? Recycling and reduction are just not prevalent in many areas I've visited. “

    I have, and yes, you are right, recycling, reduction and reusing are not prevalent in the areas I've visited too. Or areas where friends are from who have visited me.

    But leading by example starts the discussion, and gets folks thinking about recycling, reduction and reusing.

  109. “Without government mandates (that are hard enough to get through the lobbies and narrow interests) we'd still be driving around without airbags or seatbelts and filling up with leaded gas. Nobody complains about that now, but they all made a huge ruckus when it was first proposed.”

    True, and I would add that public pressure from concerned citizens has made a difference too.

  111. Well, sure, if stores don't give bags they're not part of the problem being addressed. Good for them!

    Anyway, the precise line from http://www.stoptheseattlebagtax.com/facts/ (sponsored by 7-Eleven and the American Chemistry Council) is “Grocery items from big box stores like Wal-Mart and Target? Also could be exempt.”

    There are no Wal-Mart's within Seattle city limits, so by similar logic to Costco I guess they're 'exempt', too, eh?

    No dice on Target, though. “Could be exempt” if they were exempt, which they wouldn't have been.

    I guess I should stop beating the dead horse. The amount of misinformation in this campaign just sickens me.

  112. I agree. Low income families, like those who use food banks may not have the resources to hang onto the reusable bags (the lucky ones have the back seat of their car might be filled with things like their children, overnight). I was swayed when when someone from a food bank was on KOUW and said that they gave out reusable bags and two weeks later no one still had those bags to collect their food.

    Additionally I am sick to death of living in the People's Republic of Seattle.

    I will let my neighbors call de-tox before I put a wine bottle in the trash can, I will keep rotting food on my counter to toss in the yard waste, I will yield to bikes and stand in the pouring rain at 3 am if the sign says “Don't Walk” but for the love of Pete let me run by Safeway and pickup some groceries without charging me 20 cents because my reuasble bags are on the back porch.

  113. I voted against the bag tax as I didn't like the idea of people bringing all their bags to the store that have been tossed behind the seat in the car , stepped on or tossed in the corner somewhere to be contaminated by human or animal. Maybe am a germ nut, but don't want my groceries put on a conveyor belt that has had some dirty bags on it before I get there. I take my plastic bags back to get credit when I have them clean to do so, but how many are going to wash their reusable bags. You set them on the ground, on the car floor boards etc.

    With all the hand washing they keep telling us to do to be on the safe side, how can a bag that has been used often be clean? The ones I have, don't think you can even wash them.

    Even on the news this week, they were telling everyone who wore flip flops to make sure you took them off at the door because of all the germs, e coli etc. that was on them and your feet. YUK

  116. The pressure from concerned citizens got drowned out by $1.4 million dollars for something that should never have been on the ballot to begin with. Our council should have just put it to their own vote, and not hide behind the ballot initiative.

  117. Yeah, it's done. I'm sick of it too, just like I am of TV news, political ads, libertarian cranks, anti tax cranks, anti tunnel cranks, etc etc etc…

  118. The example that many/most of us already bring reusable bags to the store, at least some of the time. The examples that each household gets one small garbage can for the week, and that we recycle religiously at home and in public, that we compost household food and yard waste. The example that many people commute to work by bus, bike, or foot. The example that lots of folks are buying organic and/or sustainably raised foods. The example that even more are growing that at home or in a pea patch. The example that most gardeners in Seattle are organic, whether they're growing food or not.

    Seattle is far, far ahead of many cities elsewhere in the country in all that we do for our own health, as well as the planet's. The examples above are a short list, but part of a much longer one. Maybe it's easy to lose perspective when you're so close to it, but do a little travel and you'll have your eyes opened to just how far ahead of the curve we actually are here in Seattle.

  119. Bacteria is everywhere–but your concern is somewhat legitimate. Unsanitary bags stained with meat/chicken blood and dairy products can be a serious health hazard. It's always safe to wash your hands and veggies/fruits whenever you can. I remember watching a Safeway checker wiping away a pool of beef blood from the conveyor belt because the previous customer didn't bother to bag the meat.

    Anyway, I voted for the bag tax because I felt reducing plastic waste was far more important than my brief exposure to bacteria in the public.

  122. That's where I disagree. We might be a little ahead of some US cities, but we're a bunch of pigs compared to the rest of the world. Europeans have had to pay directly for the bags they used for decades, but that's nothing compared to the fact that the rest of the world gets by living very well in houses half the size of ours and driving 1/10th as much as we do.
    Big flipping deal that a few dozen families have an organic garden or that a few hundred of us went to the farmers market. The consumption in the US is freakishly wasteful and because some parts of Seattle are 6% less wasteful than the rest of the gluttons in the US is hardly anything to be proud of.

  123. Nickels is out. The bag tax is out. Hutchinson moves ahead.

    Maybe Obama and the Democrats should start paying attention before they try to force expensive, budget busting, tax increasing, special intereest pay off programs down peoples throats.

  124. I agree with you that we consume too much, but buying it and carrying it home in plastic bags (or not) are two completely different issues.

  125. 1. The petroleum in 14 plastic bags could drive a car 1 mile.

    2. Americans use over 14 billion plastic bags a year.

    3. It takes 70% more global warming gasses to make a paper bag than a plastic bag.

    4. Paper bags do *not* biodegrade in landfills.

    5. Cities (that would be *us* as taxpayers) spend up to 17 cents per bag in disposal costs.

  126. Hutchison can get in because she's going up against a bunch of dems in the primary with no R next to her name. In the general it will be a blowout and I doubt she'll get anything higher than what she got now percentage wise.

Leave a Reply